HUMMER H2 vs FLASH FLOOD

[nugget]

You're kidding me right? Watch the video again not only do I go through way less 1 foot of water in my 8000 pound Deuce, but a 2 door Toyota goes through it coming from the opposite direction right in front of me. When you make a statement like that you better be able to put your money where your mouth is. I have experience in fording water as well as knowing those roads and I made an educated decision. Let me ASSURE YOU "bendyprissy" I would never ever ever put my family in danger ... Just because you are afraid to cross that water doesn't mean it can't be crossed safely (as shown in my video) More experiance than the mud puddle at the end of Macy's parking lot is needed to understand what's safe and what's not. You most likely have no idea what your HUMMER is capable of ... Kinda reminds me of the extended clip/assault rifle argument ... if you are afraid of it ... it's got to be wrong. Maybe you should stick to worrying about running into "Bigfoot" on the trail instead of commenting on me and my family and something you quite clearly know nothing about.

WOW, chill out champ. I have a fair bit of experience with water crossings here in Aussie, I don't shop at Macy's and I am more worried about drop bears than Bigfoot. I was also the first one to question what you did.

I think the answer to what you said above is that just becasue you were willing to drive through that water, doesn't mean it was safe either. The depth of the water is not the issue, it is the speed of the water. That water is hooting and the forces in play made it, in my opinion dangerous. In the first couple of crossings there were what appear to be large rocks being washed across the road by the force of the water. You got through, great, but there was a definite element of risk and whilst you went through, there were others with 4WD's who didn't. That doesn't make them whimps....they just decided the risk wasn't worth it whilst you decided the risk was.

Here is the recommended approach from a Local Government here in Aussie which has a lot of flash flooding in their area. Sorry but they blow away some of your assertions.

[h=2]Caution when crossing a flooded road![/h]
Flood Statistics

Statistics clearly point out the high risk of driving in and around flooded roads and crossing flooded water courses. Usually, individuals between the ages of 25-39 years old attempt to drive through flooded roads only to be washed away by rapidly flowing water. If depth markers are not available, the rule is simple: If you cannot see the road or its line markings, do not drive through the water. Sometimes it cannot be seen that the road surface is damaged or washed away.

Effect of Moving Water on Vehicles

Moving water exerts pressure on either a car or person. As the water depth increases, the greater is the surface area exposed to moving water and the greater is the force exerted on the vehicle or individual. Faster flowing water multiplies this effect. Often the road surface also becomes slippery, such as at a river crossing where friction is further reduced as water, sand or mud replace the frictional forces that hold the vehicle to the road.

Consideration of 4WD and Sport Utility Vehicles (SUVs)

Even though the weight of 4WDs and Sport Utility Vehicles (SUVs) may appear to offer greater protection in crossing flooded roads, their size and larger tires can often make them more buoyant and more prone to being swept away. The Bottom Line: It is just as dangerous to drive an 4WD or SUV through flooded waters as it is a regular vehicle.

Diesel vs Petrol Engines

One of the greatest risks when crossing water is to ‘stall’ and stop because of water in the vehicle’s engine. This exposes the occupants to much great danger as they are forced to exit the vehicle. Stalling is particularly common with petrol engined vehicles when water, spray or a wave enter the electrics of the engine. This situation is worsened by the speed of the vehicle creating a wave increasing the depth of water being crossed. This is far less a problem with diesel engined vehicles. When driving a petrol engine vehicle, do not attempt to cross water where you cannot see the road or its line markings.


[h=3]Summary[/h]Some statistics to remember if you are ever faced with the decision of crossing a flooded roadway:

• As little as 300mm or 1 foot of water can move most cars off the road
• Just 150mm or 6 inches of fast-moving flood water can sweep a person off his or her feet
• Most flood-related deaths occur at night and are vehicle related
• Small stream flash floods often occur in less than one hour and can cause water to rise several metres.

 

[MuDnYrI]

I think what some of the people here are concerned with is...it's one thing to put yourself in danger but suprising you would put your family in that "boat". Sorry if that sounded harsh.

Wow, that was mean! I was not the only one who said what I said here, but I just used different words (I have never been able to BS around). If you look back over everyone's comments then you would see that 2 people had no concerns while 9 did. I'm not saying you don't care about your family; I don't know you, maybe you do and maybe you don't. I also have no idea what you or your vehicle are capable of and I am overjoyed that you are an off-road water master. I just wonder why I was the only one to receive your attack? Oh well, what do I know, guess I'll just go back to the mud puddle at the end of the Macy's parking lot & see if I can discover Bigfoot.

Maybe it wouldn't have sounded so bad if I ended it with

"Sorry if that sounded harsh"

:huh:
Look ... you are entitled to your perception however you made a directed comment that I put myself and my family in danger. That is simply not true. I could see how this video may have the perception of a real "flash flood" but trust me when I tell you the people who live upo there and encounter this type of thing all the time (unless they have a small Honda, Hyundai, etc) drive right through that on their way home from work. Take a closer look at the video. That water is shallow and narrow of which myself and my HUMMER are more than capeable of handeling. Look closely at the oncoming vehicle ... you can see how shallow the water is not even coming close to my rockers.
Maybe I should have called this thread HUMMER H2 vs shallow/narrow stream of water. :hmm:
Again you said I put mysel and my family in Danger and again I tell you I didn't.
BTW:

 

[3Hummers]

If you aren't there it is hard to call the shot. We all know that things don't always look the same in pictures or video. Clearly the H2 easily handled the depth and flow of the water. While we all know water crossings have their risks it is hard to argue that he properly evaluated the crossings that we're made. Like I said earlier I have made a lot of crossings all successfully. I have not made a fair number. Probably could have made many of them but I wasn't comfortable with them so I made the right decision. Lots of good points in this thread.

 

[bendyprissy]

I made a directed comment because again I do not believe in BS & being politically correct. I am a scuba diver and am COMPLETELY aware of what water is capable of. I am also a nurse & get to take care of the results of people who thought they were more than qualified to put themselves and others in many different situations. And a heads up, water accidents rarely end well. You posted a video of you driving thru fast- moving water in a situation that can change for the worse in a matter of minutes with your family in the background. Not only do you put yourself in danger but you put your family in danger and you put the medical personnel in danger who have to come rescue you all should it not go the way you anticipated. And again, I get to see the end result of that a lot more than you would think. With that said, if you don't want my response, and "educated" at that, then don't post a video like that because what kind of nurse would I be if didn't speak up and educate?

 

[MuDnYrI]

OK ... Now I understand where you are coming from. Obviously as a Nurse you run into quite a
lot of bad situations. My Mother was
the Head Nurse at St Vincent's Hospital in New York City. My Father was a NYC
Fireman as Well as a Major in the Air force Flight Nurse. Both of them Volunteer
for the Red Cross for over 20 years and travel all over the Country to
disasters. They have both seen very bad things. My Father saw Guys ripped apart
by Motorcycle accidents and made me a deal that I could race Motocross as much
as I wanted but could never purchase a Street Motorcycle. If I did he promised
to smash it up with a Hammer. My Mother saw children come into her Hospital
involved in Motocross accidents and was afraid that I was going to become
paralyzed because I raced Motocross.
bendprissy ... you are a professional
at Nursing however you are not an "off road water master" In other words as
3HUMRERS put it "If you aren't there it is hard to call the shot."
Like 08H3
said "You can pretty much drive straight across just about any flow as long as
it is going UNDER your truck, but once it starts pushing on the side, all hell
can break loose in a hurry."
This water was far under my Truck. Look God
Bless you. You do things I would or could never do however what I did was safe.
I would never put my family in harms way. You don't know me but I can tell you
that being surrounded by a Medical family, my bro is a DR. cousins that are Dr.s
Nurses/Fireman Paramedics of which all have seen this video, know me and know
what I did was as safe as could be. Just last night my Paramedic/Fireman cousin
from AZ saw the video and said she wished she was there and want's to come
wheeling with us next time she visits. What is risk ... I mean every time you
put your family in the car or fly in a plane you put your family at risk. Bottom
line is I could have driven across those waters 513,142 times with exactly the
same outcome as the video shows.

 

[bendyprissy]

Good luck to you & stay safe!

 

[nugget]

Not wanting to flog a dead horse but I guess this is why I am so cautious of fast moving water...this is happening in my state right now with 20 swift water rescues overnight.



[h=2]Queensland[/h]
[h=1]Brisbane and southeast face localised flooding over weekend with potential for 300mm to fall before Monday [/h]



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ll-before-monday/story-e6freoof-1226561298787

 

[MuDnYrI]

This subject is very important and I am glad you brought it back up again. What
those people from your State ended up in is very deep fast moving water. IMO
this type of a water crossing should never be attempted as the results are
nothing less than disaster as shown in that news story you posted. The water
crossing I did was inches deep and was, can and will be crossed by other
Vehicles then and in the future. My video although looking much more ominous
than it actually was not anywhere as bad as the Gavial Creek water flood. I have
listed another video from the same area: Red Rock that shows the beginning of a
different flash flood. The reason I'm attaching this video is to show how
ominous the water looks in the video yet the actual water depth which is just
inches. Pretty much the same speed and depth I went through.
Nugget, as your statistics mentioned:
"As little as 300mm or 1 foot of water can move most cars off the
road"
I was is less than that and knowing that and having been through deeper
than that let me make a confident decision to proceed. You may not do it ...
other 4x4's may not attempt it but now you know you can if put in that
situation.
Like I said prior: I could have driven across those waters 513,142
times with exactly the
same outcome as the video shows.
Knowledge is King and if you don't know than don't do
Take from this what you will but at least you and others are aware, (put
in a situation) of what your HUMMER can do if
needed.

[video=youtube;Fn87efdySI8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fn87efdySI8[/video]


Yours Truly,
MuDnYrI

 

[nugget]

WOW ….. I was trying to be pretty low key about the whole thing and just have a gentle input as to some of the potential problems gained as a result of experience, most of which was gained whilst you were still growing pubic hair.

It is particularly decent of you to patronisingly share your wealth of knowledge on both of your water crossings. Of course I have a slight advantage as you obviously have no idea about what my level of experience is given you don’t even know what type of vehicle I drive, where as I have video evidence of your actions.

What you clearly have no concept of, despite it having been pointed out numerous times, is that it is not the depth of the water which was of concern, but the speed of the water.

One thing you are right about is that knowledge is king. The problem is that you would have had to be a bloody psychic to gain that knowledge as you didn’t even get out of your vehicle. Forgive me for assuming you don’t have X-ray vision. I could not see any depth markers on the side of the road but correct me if I am wrong on that as I can only read Aussie.

The last time someone told me they had driven through the same water a few weeks earlier and it was OK then, was by another contributor to the forum who used to drive a yellow H3. The bottom line is that you assumed you knew how deep it was, you assumed the road surface was OK, you assumed that a log was not going to be swept in the very fast flowing water and you assumed that even if it was, it would not hit the side of your truck. Apparently you are happy to assume all that over 500,000 times and with water and mud, you can NEVER assume.

I don’t really care if you believe your shiny H2 is unsinkable and that your gung ho attitude will get you through any situation. What worries me is that people with even less experience than you, think you know what you are talking about and find themselves in trouble.

 

[MuDnYrI]

I don’t really care if you
believe your shiny H2 is unsinkable and that your gung ho attitude will get you
through any situation. What worries me is that people with even less experience
than you, think you know what you are talking about and find themselves in
trouble.

Can someone please tell me why I feel the need to defend myself against ridiculas statements like this?
So let me get this straight. You think that peolpe on this forum (or from anywhere) will watch my
video as I drive through litterally inches of water ... then decide to try
faster deeper dangerous water (without knowing anything) only to ffind themselves in trouble?
If you look at the Home page of this website you will see an H3 driving in a river with much deeper water. This is what
HUMMERS can do if you know what you are doing..
I never assumed anything about the road I crossed. I absolutly knew it height of the water (wether you beleive me or not)
Nugget ...you are quite clearly the 1 who is very upset here.
You have your opinion and I know what I know.

 

[Chook]

On a lighter note............ Here is a Video Clip of flash flooding this week in Australia ex Tropical Cyclone Oswald (@ Barron Falls just north of Cairns)

http://youtu.be/fHNuXHyS410

Here is a video of the same Falls 5 Months ago

http://youtu.be/R4KlvT2Za1c

 

[MuDnYrI]

On a lighter note............ Here is a Video Clip of flash flooding this week in Australia ex Tropical Cyclone Oswald (@ Barron Falls just north of Cairns)

[video=youtube;fHNuXHyS410]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHNuXHyS410&feature=youtu.be[/video]

With a little practice I think I could cross it :wink:

 

[nugget]

I absolutely believe that inexperienced people see stuff on forums and assume, unless it is pointed out otherwise, that it is the norm, until they learn otherwise, hopefully without any harm being done.

I will repeat again, the danger in what you did, was not the depth of the water but the speed of the water. That is why more care was required. It doesn't mean that it could not be done, b ut the speed of the water meant that ALL the information was required prior to plunging in.

You did not know how deep the water was...sorry...you could not have as you took no measure to determine how deep it actually was and there were no depth markers on the side of the road. The last crossing was obviously much deeper than the earlier ones so was that one still "literally inches deep", almost a foot, a bit over a foot....? Again, it is the speed of the water that gets you into trouble, and as speed and depth increase, so does the risk.

I have crossed a couple of creeks in my travels and played around in plenty of water and mud, and every time I assume, trouble strikes.

For this crossing on Cape York, we walked the crossing numerous times even though the water was crystal clear and we could easily see the bottom. We estimed the depth as bit over knee high with a pot hole we could see being a bit deeper. The pot hole was in fact chest deep but by walking it, we were able to work out the best line to cross safely.

This is the exact spot where another H3, who assumed that the depth was the same as the last he crossed, turned into the yellow submarine. My son walked the crossing first before we determined it was safe to cross.

We had been driving this area all weekend and been through numerous patches of water where the bottom was hard sand and the water was "literally inches" deep. I assumed this stretch would be the same but came to a halt when the water was at the top of the box that the seat is mounted to. All the other crossings had been fine but I assumed wrong on this one.....big time. It seems to happen every time I assume.....funny about that...

All I am saying is that any water crossing needs to be approached with caution and the faster the speed of the water, the greater the amount of caution.
I am not upset. I am lucky enough to have you advise me on what Hummers are capable of...gotta be happy with that.

 

[MuDnYrI]

I absolutely believe that inexperienced people see stuff on forums and assume, unless it is pointed out otherwise, that it is the norm, until they learn otherwise, hopefully without any harm being done.

I would ask you if you just got kicked in the head to many times by a Kangaroo but that would be rude :wink:

OK, so I guess your next move is to what ... try to have YouTube removed or police forums for videos you don't care for?
EXTRA EXTRA Read all about it Nugget saves dumbass from himself :wink: :jump:
:gday:

 

[autumn walker]

wow. this got out of control quickly.

 

[nugget]

Aren't you the angry ant. When you want to have a civil debate about the do and don't of water crossings, let me know. Clearly you didn't know how deep the water was and even more clearly you have no comprehension of, nor respect for the power of water.

Obviously you don't agree, but I believe that we have a duty of care to post responsibly. Going out to find flash flooding with a wife and young son does not fall into that category in my humble opinion. Sometimes a little knowledge can be very dangerous. The bottom, line is that you put them and yourself in a position of increased risk.

If that level of risk is acceptable to you, then that is your call, and I am sure some on here will agree with you. Having said that, if you put it out there, don't expect everyone to automatically agree.

On a personal note, next time you make those sorts of comments about me, don't expect a civil response.