My 5.3 Engine swap

[humvee]

Hope this helps.

It sure does Casey.. They never got back to me regarding the loaded input drum for my Hummer. Gonna call them again today and see if they can make one and ship it with the rest of the upgrades.

With the harness coming in after the weekend, I'll get busy on the motor and do the tranny right after.
Mechanic keeps nagging me to replace solenoid parts. I do not know what he means, and plan to continue ignoring this completely.

 

[humvee]

Ordered a loaded input drum, upgraded servo (full assembly $50) and hardened sun shell.

This will all arrive in 7 days time. Hopefully the harness comes in on Sunday and I'll have an update.

 

[CaseyS]

Check back to post #24. Just checking that you have also ordered the ISS (input speed sensor) and the internal wiring harness that has the connector for the ISS. Your factory internal harness will not have a wire for the ISS. Sounds like Jamie has verified the harness (vehicle harness) has a wire for the sensor. That harness will be plugged externally into the transmission connector. Also you need to verify that your pump cover has the bore in it to support the ISS.

Post #2 below.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/automatic-transmission/1208914-4l60e-converter-advice-please-adding-iss.html

Link for harness. Last one on the page.

https://www.gmtransmissionparts.com/700r4-4l60e-4l65e/electronics/

I don't see a link for the ISS (24244544) on their page but they should have it. Standard part.

As far as the solenoids, don't worry about it. They either work or they don't. Plus if one fails, they can be changed with the trans in the truck, just drop the pan to change them.

Sorry for the late followup. As you get further in, it toggles my memory to help your research. If I were doing this I have a local shop that likely has all of this in stock. Your logistics have got to be a nightmare.

 

[humvee]

Check back to post #24. Just checking that you have also ordered the ISS (input speed sensor) and the internal wiring harness that has the connector for the ISS.

Casey, i called up Gmtransmissionparts and told them to add it to the box.
But also just spoke with Jamie, who's now telling me I wont need this at all.

What model year was your swap? I'm going 09 to 09 and jamie said it should all be there.

What do you think?

 

[humvee]

Check back to post #24.

i reread the post, makes a lot more sense now.

Jamie had told me this was the case up until 2008, where i5 Colorados got the ISS setup just like the V8.

Are you certain 09 i5 trannys don't come with the internal wiring harness hooked up to an existing ISS?





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[CaseyS]

i reread the post, makes a lot more sense now.

Jamie had told me this was the case up until 2008, where i5 Colorados got the ISS setup just like the V8.

Are you certain 09 i5 trannys don't come with the internal wiring harness hooked up to an existing ISS?





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Good catch. You should be correct. 08 and up should already have the ISS sensor and correct internal harness. You should only need the correct input drum like you originally ordered. My fault for not catching that.

If you are in the position to, you can verify that you do have the ISS by simply pulling the pan and looking.

My conversion was 06 and did not have the ISS.

 

[humvee]

Great! I have actually confirmed this with a few colorado owners, never on a South African made H3 i5, so that I should do first thing tomorrow morning.

I'm glad you brought this up, it made me pull the trigger on some more replacement rings, straps and stuff.


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[humvee]

The harness arrived today, Jamie went about labeling the wires down to 'fuel injector 1, 2 etc. we were on the phone when I was removing the PCM/TCM and I cracked the bracket housing.. He surprised me with a new GM bracket to replace the old one completely.

I took the input drum back to the dealer but they refused a refund, I could've argued but opted for 2 step bars to go with my rock sliders. My better half has been complaining about getting in and out of the truck for a while.

Unfortunately, Sam has started a few Wrangler builds while waiting for my harness, so I'll have to wait till next week to get started on mine... Fair considering I took up space in his shop for a while now.

I'll update when the build resumes.


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[humvee]

The build is on its way again. It was about 10 minutes in when I found that I didn't have an oil pan pipe, it was taken out before I got the motor, and replaced with an incompatible LS3 pipe instead.

Wasn't willing to wait another 2 weeks to ship a new one over, so we improvised.

Cut, matched and welded the bends and straights with a pipe from a Wrangler JK that was lying around.

We also dropped the tranny, and the guys started taking it apart. New tranny parts come in on Sunday, so we're getting ready for a quick install when that happens.

The electrician couldn't start working on the harness just yet, so started installing a new Sony stereo I got from Crutchfield.com. Trying to make that work with the Monsoon system shouldn't be an issue.

Also forgot that during Chris' build, he found that the motor mounts were labeled the wrong way around. So the motor didn't mount in place, we called it a day finally and decided to resume tomorrow.

 

[humvee]

Day 3 of the swap.

So the tranny parts are finally here and being taking it apart. I'm still missing the oil seals at the front where the drum spleen meets the TC, and the back at the transfer case, someone is on his way to get those. Input drum, upgraded sunshield and servo should be done today.

The motor motor mounts were not a direct fit, we had to trim a bit off the bracket to get it to fit flush. I'm not very happy with the design and don't know how these small mounts will cope with desert offroading, but its too early to judge.

Motor is finally in, and the harness Jamie made is looking good so far.
I took out the TB and gave it a thorough cleaning inside and out.

3 issues still loom:

a) I'm reusing the clutch fan from the i5, which has less blades than its V8 counterpart, and pushes out less air. Hoping the 16" electric fan I add on the outside compensates for this.

b) The power steering pump doesn't bolt onto the alternator bracket I bought. Will try and get a different one later today.

c) I can't find the power steering pulley anywhere. Hope I can find the bracket with an undamaged pulley still attached, make it work until I can order a new one from the US.

Most of the above is straight forward if the parts were accessible, everything else is pretty much plug and play so far and I'm not worried.

 

[humvee]

Couldn't find the alternator bracket today, will look again tomorrow.
The mechanic wasn't able to start on the tranny, so it has to be tomorrow too.

But.. the day wasn't totally wasted. we got started on the exhaust downpipes. The manifolds I got are from a Corvette LS3, the passenger side manifold points directly down at the chassis. We routed it away directly after the flange.

The cats I chose are the Zeuna-Starker KT0165, these are used on the Mercedes CLK 320, got them at a good price new.
I won't be adding a second cat, just one on each side with the O2 an sensor on either side.

 

[humvee]

Urgent question

Question, and I really hope someone chimes in here... It seems I won't get the alternator bracket I need here in Doha, which is the one that fits on the colorado, Chevy 2500/3500 trucks.

Thinking to install a 1500 truck bracket/pump combo. It will mount fine, but the pump on these attaches much lower than ours.
Dealers have a no refund policy on pumps here. Does anyone know why this pump was ditched by Hummer? I'd like to know if anyone has done this before I go out and get one tomorrow.

Thanks

 

[Happy Hummer]

Fascinating build thread. Wow!

 

[CaseyS]

Are you sure that won't interfere with the steering box mounted that low? Hard to tell by the picture.

That looks like the exact same pump on my Cummins. If the pulley is pressed on make sure to use the threads in the end of the shaft to pull the pulley on the shaft. Do NOT squeeze the back side of the case, you will crush the internals and the pump won't work.

 

[humvee]

Not very sure, I'll borrow a used unit from a scrap shop, test it before I move forward.
Its the same one on the escalades and tahoes.. Can't find specs of these pumps online.

So we'll experiment and see


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[humvee]

Are you sure that won't interfere with the steering box mounted that low?

You were right. I couldn't get my hands on one, but I took a few measurements and it surely won't clear the steering components.

Contacted GMPARTSDIRECT.com again, the $180 issue is still pending, sorted it out with PayPal and they won't be charging me when I release the funds again.
Hoping they'll answer this Email after ignoring the last 3.


Fingers crossed.

 

[humvee]

My friend is swamped with orders and needed his best mechanic to work on other trucks, so I sent out my tranny to another shop to be worked on.
I'll get it back on Thursday.

In the meantime, I did something I've been longing to do, deleted the egr intake. Its been breaking loose and rattling for a while now.

And finally, deleting the side scoops. I always wanted this look.

 

[humvee]

Update..
The rebuilt tranny comes in tomorrow, excited to get the work done. Once that is in, the welder will sort out the rest of the exhaust work as the electrician hooks up the rest of the harness.

I've reached a brick wall with the alternator bracket. No response to my Emails, GMpartsdirect have caused me a great deal of headache.

Worked on the bumper and LED bar bracket some more to pass time.

 

[humvee]

Tranny shop came in with this... saying the oil pump needs to be changed as well as the shaft is longer.
The new pump I need should match with the new housing.

Should be the same pump, so perhaps they're missing something.
Will try to get more pictures side by side.

any ideas?

 

[CaseyS]

Nope. You should be good. All the pumps and stator supports are the same. Remember you have a different torque converter and the combination of the input shaft and correct torque converter and bell housing depth put the torque converter pads at the correct depth for the particular flexplate depth of the engine.

Eg. The LT series engines 5.7, etc flexplate offset from the back of the block is a different take up than the LS engines.

There were two different pump to case seal designs but you are reusing your pump so no worries there.

Take a look at your torque converters. The original and the new one likely have a different hub length. This will account for your take up.

Make sure you get the order of the shim washer and thrust bearing between the drum and the pump correct. Reuse your existing washer, it will likely have like a 69 or 70 stamped on it. Test fit the torque converter on the bench like you are setup in that pic and test fit it again before you bolt the bell housing back on to make sure the pump turns free.

 

[humvee]

Thanks C, I'll get the new TC and match it up at the shop like you said.
Is there a possibility that the outer shell of the reman drum is a different shape, or are there parts between the pump and Drum that render this irrelevant?


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[humvee]

Nope. You should be good. All the pumps and stator supports are the same.

Tranny guy is saying the difference is 19mm. Does this sound accurate?

Will go over there later and take close up pictures, this is the level of tranny workmanship here that I was talking about coming into the project.

 

[CaseyS]

Holy crap these transmissions piss me off! I think I will have to stand corrected.

http://www.bulkpart.com/2/category/4L60E-4L65Epump.html

Measure the inside length of the stator support. This piece is pressed into the inner pump cover. It looks like one has a length of 6 7/8" and another 7 5/16" This is an 11.1 cm difference. I'm going to go check the length on my old '06 one.

In the link I posted, the A74529D shows for current years and matches to 245 and 298 mm converters (the hummer runs the little 245 mm converter)

The A74529E lists for 300mm converters (LS engines) and is longer.

I may have never have caught this in my swap because I went from the 245 hummer converter to a 298 LT1 style converter and they use the same stator support. The good news is if you need the longer length, you can just get the stator support. The old one will need to be pressed out and the new one pressed in.

Keep me posted.

Edit: Just for clarity and to answer your earlier question, the drum length itself should all be the same as it and the reverse drum all have to stack inside the case and the pump bolts on last to secure everything inside. The difference in length is in the shaft length and stator support length which sticks out outside of the case.

 

[humvee]

The A74529E lists for 300mm converters (LS engines) and is longer.

Thanks for breaking it down.
I passed by this morning before seeing this post, took some pictures as it was coming together.
He agreed with your previous post once I read it out to him. Checked the fitment of both setups before making any conclusions.

Pump on the old drum (i5)

Pump on the new drum. Difference I measured was 15mm.

EDIT: Side by side in the converter, the new converter does push the drum up.

Phone died here.

Tranny was closed up, fit in the bell housing well. They'll send it back to Sam's garage tomorrow to install it. But I think you're right and it won't line up. I'll go back to snap a few pictures and measure how far the input shaft protrudes from the housing.

 

[CaseyS]

It will line up and bolt up, BUT here's the rub.

I went back and looked at some of my build info. The I5 flexplate is 1.47" aft of the bellhousing mating surface on the rear of the block. On LT based setups, the flexplate is closer at 1.02". On LS setups I think it is another 0.4" closer in still. The issue right now is not the length of your input shaft, you have the right shaft and it is longer because it needs to be for the LS engine with the right torque converter, because the LS flexplate is closer to the block than the I5 flexplate.

That was a good catch by your mechanic but possibly not for the right reason. If you put you torque converter on and bolt it up, it will likely look ok. However with the stator shaft too short it may only partially engage the stator or even worse not engage it at all. Best case is the vehicle won't move, worst case, you end up with shredded wheat aluminum in your trans case.

You can install the torque converter in the assembled trans and take a measurement from the bellhousing face to the torque converter pads. You will need a straightedge across the bellhousing face to do this. Then take a measurement from the flexplate face to the rear of the block. The difference should be about 3/16". When you install the trans you will see that gap between the torque converter pads and the flexplate. Snugging up the torque converter bolts will pull the converter slightly forward and the pump "ears" will still be engaged in the two slots of the hub.

If you do this I think you will find your takeups correct, but the converter may be wobbly because the stator is not engaged. Don't get too far ahead because I think the bell housing and pump will need to come back off and the stator support pressed out and replaced with the longer one.

Hopes this makes sense. Don't feel bad either. I spent a LOT of trans research trying to get all the parts figured out for my adapter setup. This was part of the swap I really thought I could just buy a chevy pattern adapter and bolt it right up, but that was far from the case.