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The Gun Control Debate - A Place for Your Perspective

3Hummers

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Central Texas
This is a battle of inches and the left will never quit until they reach their goals, one of which is an unarmed America. They will advance a few more inches toward the goal line with this. Look how far they have come in the last 30 years. Each step is a platform from which to launch the next assault on your rights. That is why you have to fight even the most insignificant of their proposals. Look at the vast data base of medical information they have already and what they are going to assemble once Obamacare is fully implemented. If doctors input information on patient gun ownership they have a defacto registration system. If one of my doctors ever ask me about gun ownership I am not going to tell him it is none of his business ( which they would take as a yes ) I will just say no.
 

abearden

Well-Known Member
Messages
609
Location
N. Idaho
Look at the vast data base of medical information they have already and what they are going to assemble once Obamacare is fully implemented. If doctors input information on patient gun ownership they have a defacto registration system.
Actually, they specifically slipped a clause into Obamacare that prohibited a database of gun ownership data. So they can ask, but it can't be stored legally.
 

3Hummers

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Central Texas
Yes but a medical database with firearm information in it is not technically a reistration or ownership database, it is a medical database that contains some generic firearm information. Not enough to say what you have, just enough to say you are one of the ones that have them.
 

abearden

Well-Known Member
Messages
609
Location
N. Idaho
If it's a Federal database related to Obamacare, it's prohibited to contain gun ownership data unless they pass new laws allowing it:

SEC. 2716 (2) and (3):
(2) LIMITATION ON DATA COLLECTION.—None of the authorities provided to the Secretary under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act or an amendment made by that Act shall be construed to authorize or may be used for the collection of any information relating to—A) the lawful ownership or possession of a firearm or ammunition; (B) the lawful use of a firearm or ammunition; or (C) the lawful storage of a firearm or ammunition.(3) LIMITATION ON DATABASES OR DATA BANKS.— None of the authorities provided to the Secretary under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act or an amendment made by that Act shall be construed to authorize or may be used to maintain records of individual ownership or possession of a firearm or ammunition.
 

3Hummers

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Central Texas
Saw that Kurt. In their haste to do good they did bad. As to the database issue I don't trust the information given out by the government nor do I trust them to follow the law. Obama and Holder have shown an absolute disdain for the law...when it applies to them. This Administration is still in contempt of court on the offshore drilling ban that was lifted by the courts, ignores Congressional subpoena's for information, ignores FOIA requests and who knows what else.
 

deserth3

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,078
Location
Conroe, TX
Part of New Yorks problem is it's a Union State and many people blindly follow how thw Union tells them to vote. I don't have much sympathy for them. They voted these idiots into office. So now they are paying the piper.
 

f5moab

Mr. Beretta
Messages
1,997
Location
In hiding.....
If it's a Federal database related to Obamacare, it's prohibited to contain gun ownership data unless they pass new laws allowing it:

SEC. 2716 (2) and (3):
(2) LIMITATION ON DATA COLLECTION.—None of the authorities provided to the Secretary under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act or an amendment made by that Act shall be construed to authorize or may be used for the collection of any information relating to—A) the lawful ownership or possession of a firearm or ammunition; (B) the lawful use of a firearm or ammunition; or (C) the lawful storage of a firearm or ammunition.(3) LIMITATION ON DATABASES OR DATA BANKS.— None of the authorities provided to the Secretary under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act or an amendment made by that Act shall be construed to authorize or may be used to maintain records of individual ownership or possession of a firearm or ammunition.

I do believe it was Harry Reid who got this put into Obama care. Harry's a moron, but he has primarily been a gun friendly moron.

As for Doctors asking if you have guns, ask them to fill out your form that asks how many malpractice suits they have been involved with.
 

deserth3

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,078
Location
Conroe, TX
Saw that list. On the surface it doesn't sound too bad, until you start thinking about it. Arbitrary gov't controlled classification of mental illness, national registry giving the gov't a list of every gun anyone buys, weakening HIPAA (forget about keeping your medical issues secret from the gov't), and spelling out that your doctor can (is encouraged to?) ask you what guns you own... I have serious doubts about the constitutional legality of some of this. What he is encouraging congress to do is far worse.

And that NY stuff, I have no clue how something so ridiculous could ever be passed. Max 7 round mag capacity? Background checks for ammunition? New classification of what an "assault weapon" is? Absurd.

One of the guys from my work said he read an article from a "White house Insider" that Senator Harry Reid went in just before his speach and convinced BO to change it. Besides all of the people writting their Congressman, 43 Govornors called and said they wouldn't enforce BO's plan. Beside the many articles from state Police trying to set hime straight.
But the kicker appears to be the projected loose of 4 Democratic Senate seats in 2014.
He's supposed to send me the article. If he does I'll post it up if he remembers.
 

3Hummers

Super Moderator
Staff member
Messages
10,529
Location
Central Texas
Damn, that is nice. Most of mine are just plain old whitish rocks. That black tactical rock LOOKS much more military like, aggressive and lethal than my rocks. You are right, it looks like a military style rock so they will probably give it a catchy name, demonize it in the press, form mindless hate groups and try to ban it.
 
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deserth3

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,078
Location
Conroe, TX
More seriously....
These people don't care what we think. Or give a damn about our Constitution...

Obama backers aim to outflank NRA on gun control

WASHINGTON — Supporters of President Barack Obama's gun-control proposals are planning a methodical, state-by-state campaign to try to persuade key lawmakers that it's in their political interest to back his sweeping effort to crack down on firearms and ammunition sales and expand criminal background checks.
To succeed will require overturning two decades of conventional wisdom that gun control is bad politics.
The National Rifle Association is confident that argument won't sell. But with polls showing majorities supporting new gun laws a month after the Connecticut shooting deaths of 20 schoolchildren and six adults, gun-control activists say the political calculus has changed. Their goal in coming weeks is to convince lawmakers of that, too, and to counter the NRA's proven ability to mobilize voters against any proposals limiting access to guns.
The gun-control advocates are focused first on the Senate, which is expected to act before the House on Obama's gun proposals. How Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., proceeds will depend in part on what he hears from a handful of Democrats in more conservative states where voters favor gun rights. These include some who are eyeing re-election fights in 2014, such as Mark Pryor of Arkansas, Mark Begich of Alaska and Max Baucus of Montana.
"We need to tell our members of Congress that they've got to stand up for sensible gun laws, and if they do that, we will stand up for them, and if they don't we will stand up for whoever runs against them," New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg told the U.S. Conference of Mayors Friday. "Because that's exactly what the NRA is trying to do."
Bloomberg's group, Mayors Against Illegal Guns, is among a coalition of some 50 labor unions, advocacy groups and others that have been meeting since before Christmas to plot strategy, in loose coordination with the White House, according to people involved.
Just hours after Obama rolled out his gun proposals on Wednesday, the group gathered at the headquarters of the National Education Association to game out their plans. As of Friday, voters' calls to Reid's office were running two-to-one against Obama's proposals, a Reid aide said.
Never far from such Democrats' minds is what happened in 1994, when the party suffered widespread election losses after backing President Bill Clinton's crime bill featuring a ban on assault weapons. Clinton and others credited the NRA's campaigning with a big role in those Democrats' defeats. And when the assault weapons ban came up for congressional renewal in 2004, it failed.
The goal of gun-control supporters will be to convince Democrats like Pryor, Begich and Baucus through phone calls, appearances at town hall meetings, print and TV ads and other means that voters in their state will support them if they back Obama's plans.
One group involved, the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence, ran print ads in North Dakota newspapers criticizing newly elected Democratic Sen. Heidi Heitkamp after she expressed doubts about Obama's proposals.
Activists have also identified a few Senate Republicans they hope to sway, including Mark Kirk of Illinois and Susan Collins of Maine. In the House, they're focused on 35 to 40 Republicans in suburban areas or districts carried by Obama, where voters might be more supportive of gun-control measures.
"We have a million grass-roots supporters who have sent almost 200,000 emails to Congress, tens of thousands of phone calls and are ready to go to town hall meetings and camp out if they have to," said Mark Glaze, director of the mayors group. He said of lawmakers: "In the end I'm confident that enough of them will look past the NRA's $2,000 contribution and do what the public is demanding."
But the NRA, which claims some 4 million members, has already activated its base, issuing a fiery appeal this week in which Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre warned backers: "It's about banning your guns, PERIOD! ... I warned you this day was coming and now it's here. This is the fight of the century."
As publicity spreads about Obama's proposals the NRA has been adding about 8,000 members a day, according to the group's president, David Keene. The NRA grades lawmakers on votes and has had apparent success in swaying congressional debates for years.
"We support the folks who've helped us in the past, and we remind them that we're also interested in what they do today and tomorrow," Keene said. "I'm convinced that once this thing gets debated the folks who've been with us in the past are probably going to be with us in the future."
Obama's call for an assault weapons ban is a particularly heavy lift, but backers are more optimistic about increased background checks, which were favored by 84 percent in an Associated Press-GfK poll this week.
Supporters hope those kinds of poll numbers will help move lawmakers to buck history and the NRA and vote in favor of gun-control bills.
"We definitely have our work cut out for us. The math's not with us right now in terms of the votes," said Andy Pelosi, president of Gun Free Kids. "It's going to be difficult, but I am optimistic. I think the tone in the country is much, much different, and you can't underestimate that."

The link...
http://xfinity.comcast.net/articles/news-national/20130118/US.Gun.Control/
 

3Hummers

Super Moderator
Staff member
Messages
10,529
Location
Central Texas
I made a nice sized donation to the NRA on Friday. I suggest that we all do what we can to help them help us. Don't sit back and think the next guy is going to do it. Everyone of us has to pitch in. Even if it is only $10.00 it will be a big help.
 

f5moab

Mr. Beretta
Messages
1,997
Location
In hiding.....
In today's SLC tribune...
UtahSheriff_zps23450aa0.jpg
 

Neo

Badfish
Messages
1,666
Location
Brookings, OR
that's great to see from our Sheriffs , the guns across America rallys had a pretty good turn out from what i can find. you won't see much coverage from the MSM. The Albany one had a couple thousand people show and only one news van.
 

SickStringC

Well-Known Member
Messages
302
Location
Austin, TX
I have to share this ... specifically please be open minded enough to look at the two videos clips from The Daily Show last week (also linked below):

http://www.businessinsider.com/jon-stewart-nra-atf-gun-control-obama-2013-1

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-january-16-2013/there-goes-the-boom

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-january-16-2013/there-goes-the-boom---atf

I'm an NRA supporter. I have a safe full of guns at home. I am opposed to a gun ban. I'm also a Libertarian that believes that over-legislation is a serious problem in this country. Instead of passing more laws, how about we isolate the root causes to our issues and enforce the laws that are already on the books that aim at these issues rather than passing more laws?

Thoughts??
 
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58Bisc

Well-Known Member
Messages
186
Location
Warminster, PA
Some interesting articles:
If they come for your guns...
http://www.fishgame.com/DEblog.php?p=979#.UQCFECdZWSr

Tips for terminating the 2nd amendment....
http://fishgame.com/deblog.php?p=576#.UQCHbCdZWSo

From where I sit, these seem dead on. I have family that has fought in every war this great nation has ever had. I mean every war, not just the big ones. They were some of our founding fathers and they truley believed in the concepts of a constitutional republic. I can't believe we even live at a point in time were so many don't understand what our country is truley founded on.
 
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